The Isley Brothers
FOREVER YOURS
The Legendary Isley Brothers Cap 60 Years of Soul Survival with Eternal
They survived a legal battle with Motown, the untimely death of two of their siblings, and numerous lineup changes. And through it all, the Isley Brothers have managed to outlast and outshine most of their contemporaries with a string of classics from 1959's "Shout" to 2001's "Contagious," continually setting the standard for soul, rock, funk, and contemporary R&B. Barnes & Noble.com's R&B and Hip-Hop editor, Tracy E. Hopkins, had the pleasure of walking down memory lane with the Isleys -- flamboyant lead singer Ronald, a.k.a. Mr. Biggs, and the deceptively mild-mannered fireball guitarist Ernie -- prior to the release of their latest disc, Eternal, which boasts contributions from today's urban stars, including Jill Scott, R. Kelly, Tony! Toni! Toné! main man Raphael Saadiq, and production veterans Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis.
Barnes & Noble.com: On Eternal you work with a hit list of top producers including Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. How did that collaboration come about?
Ronald Isley: We've always wanted to work together. They've said in interviews that our music influenced them to become producers. Over the years they did songs like the S.O.S Band's "If You Still Care," and I knew they had a flair for doing our type of music. Finally, with Eternal we were able to get together. We originally planned to do one or two songs with them, and we ended up with five.
B&N.com: How did the other collaborations come about?
Ronald Isley: We knew we had to meet up with R. Kelly again [Ronald sang on Kelly's hit "Down Low"] and let him do his thing on "Contagious." Raphael Saadiq is another young talent we worked with. He says he started playing guitar because of Ernie, and [his group] Tony! Toni! Toné! had a couple songs that we like to think of as Isley Brothers songs, such as "Anniversary" and "Lay Your Head on My Pillow." We thought we'd do one song with Raphael, and that turned into three.
B&N.com: Do you get reenergized by working with younger artists and producers?
Ronald Isley: We knew that recording "Contagious" with R. Kelly was going to be fun. And working with Raphael we spent almost as much time clowning around, telling jokes, and talking about girls -- ya know, things that guys do -- as much as we spent working on music. So it was a fun period. This album was not intended to be an ordinary album. We wanted to make Eternal the Thriller or Supernatural for the Isley Brothers. We wanted to top ourselves.
B&N.com: On "Contagious" you reprise the role of Mr. Biggs, who was first introduced in R. Kelly's dramatic video for "Down Low."
Ronald Isley: R. Kelly laid the record out and we told him what we wanted. The day I went into record he was playing basketball, and when he came back after his game, I had finished writing the record. The record is one of a kind -- it's like a three-part opera [with Ronald, R. Kelly, and Chante Moore singing]. We want to knock off the current competition, be it Alicia Keys, Jagged Edge, Lil' Bow Wow, or 112. Everybody in the industry knew that "Contagious" was coming, and when they saw the video it was like, "Uh-oh."
B&N.com: Was the recording process different for this album than your previous albums?
Ronald Isley: Every time you make an album you try to improve upon what you did last time. I think after this one, we will evaluate what worked and what didn't. We don't just go into the studio and start singing. If it's something that the public wants from us, we'll lean on that a little bit more the next time. If it's a certain style of singing a song, and they're eating that style up, then we may come with two or three more songs like that. But we could make the best record and some [critic] could still say that we're making music that sounds dated. We don't want to make that mistake. We're just trying to make what we consider good music. But it can be very confusing [to read what the industry wants].
B&N.com: Do you think there's a bias against older artists since younger artists like D'Angelo have been successful singing in a retro soul style?
Ronald Isley: There's a little sprinkle [of the old soul] in D'Angelo and Musiq, and they've been very successful. Those guys are saying 'This is what I've wanted to do all of my life.' So I'm not knocking them. Alicia Keys's "Fallin' " is sung in the same tone that James Brown sang "It's a Man's World." Those who know music like me and Ernie -- we can hear your tone and know which record you got it from. But I had this young girl ask me why we were singing over Biggie's song [the Notorious B.I.G.'s "Big Poppa" samples the Isley's "Between the Sheets"]. That's all she knew, but people have to learn. Then you'll know that Ice Cube's "It Was a Good Day" was the Isley's "Footsteps in the Dark"; you'll know that Salt 'N Pepa's "Shake Your Thing" was our "It's Your Thing," and a host of other songs. Then once you have this knowledge, you can go get the original record. You'll also learn that the Beatles started their career in Liverpool imitating the Isley Brothers singing "Shout" and "Twist and Shout." Then once they got out of the gate, they stopped talking about us. They never turned back around and asked us to do a show with them. It's not against the law for them not to, but it would have been nice. Maybe that would have put another feather in our cap. But people don't do that. They'll wait until you're dead and then say, "You were so great we tried to copy off of you."
B&N.com: You have such a distinctive style as a singer. In your opinion, what makes a good singer?
Ronald Isley: Your experience, what you know and who you got it from. It's almost like going to school. You have God-gifted talent, but there's always someone who you looked up to. As a kid, my mother brought me Dinah Washington records and when we did gospel music, she bought Clara Ward and the Ward singers. Then we got into Sam Cooke, Nat King Cole, Perry Como, and Frank Sinatra. All of this music was discussed in our house and we learned from it. The great thing for me is that I lived and became friends with guys like Sam Cooke. Then [as I got older], I became friends with [peers] like Smokey Robinson. When he went to Motown, we eventually went to Motown. There we became running buddies with the Supremes, Martha & the Vandellas, the Temptations, and the Four Tops. That experience was like another school. Everybody there was at the top of their game, so we were trying to make a spot for us.
B&N.com: What was your experience at Motown like?
Ronald Isley: Our first record for Motown was "This Old Heart of Mine," which was a big hit. But after that we didn't get the attention we thought we deserved, and Berry Gordy told us that if we ever felt that way, he wouldn't hold us to our contract. So we called him on that because we wanted to move on and start our own company. [Gordy] let us go for the moment and after we released "It's Your Thing" and the record exploded, he sued us and tried to bring us back to Motown. We had a bigger record than Motown then and they started patterning their records after that song. But that's how our career has been. I think about Marvin Gaye, Earth, Wind & Fire, and Teddy Pendergrass and people like that whom we were both friendly and competitive with. When Marvin Gaye made "Sexual Healing," we did "Between the Sheets," and we would get on the phone and talk to each other like, "Man, I got somethin', you better hurry up with yours." Somehow we've lasted longer than [any of our peers]. We thought the Supremes and the Temptations would be forever because they had real talent. But our talent went through the storm, came out, and continues. The Lord gave us something -- in 1959 we did "Shout," and that has taken us up to 2001. It's unheard of for any artist -- black, white, male, or female -- to have a six-decade career.
B&N.com: The Isley Brothers have such a rich history. Can you give us a brief recap?
Ronald Isley: First it was four brothers [in a gospel quartet], and [Vernon] was killed [in an accident], and then the group turned into a trio. In 1959 we came to New York and did the record "Shout," and from there we went through our Motown period. In 1969 Ernie joined the band and played on "It's Your Thing." He and Marvin were in college studying music. First we thought they were in college to become lawyers or accountants, but they wanted to get into the business. In 1973, we took pictures together for the album cover of 3+3, and on that picture there are five Isley brothers and our brother-in-law Chris Jasper. From 1973 to 1983 we were on our label, T-Neck Records, which was distributed through CBS. That carries you all the way up to the album Between the Sheets. From that period the younger brothers and Chris formed Isley, Jasper, Isley and they did several records together. Their big hit was "Caravan of Love." After Chris and Ernie did solo albums, Ernie and Marvin came back to the Isley Brothers. My oldest brother [O'Kelly] died in 1986 and at that time, my brother Rudolph decided to leave music to go into the ministry. So that left me for a moment to do some [solo] stuff. Then Marvin and Ernie came back, and we worked together as a trio until Marvin became ill with diabetes. That leaves me and Ernie.
B&N.com: In the last decade, the Isley Brothers have really been embraced by the hip-hop generation.
Ronald Isley: I was on R. Kelly's song "Down Low," which at the time was the biggest single in his career. On Eternal we did "Said Enough" with Jill Scott. She's at the top of her game and she's a fan of ours. And we admire what she's doing -- she's like a poet. But we never hire someone and lean on their talent to have success. A lot of artists put the hottest rapper on their record, and then they sing three lines. Jennifer Lopez has a nice song out ["I'm Real (Remix)"], but Ja Rule is carrying the song. When Ja Rule first came out, I did a song with him. I was like 'Who's this little up-squeak?" and his mom was like, "Sit down boy. I want to talk to Ron Isley." Now he's the man. But we never say "C'mon, let's go get Ja Rule or Jay-Z and put him on our record." I wanted to do a record with Jill Scott where people can appreciate hearing both of us.
B&N.com: You're married to singer Angela Winbush, who produced Eternal's "Warm Summer Night." Is it difficult to balance a professional and personal relationship?
Ronald Isley: When you have two people with careers and each person is trying to stay on top of their career, it takes a lot of dedication. [Angela and I] eat and sleep music. It's different for Ernie and me because we don't live in the same house. When we're in the hotel we go to our rooms and when we come back together we talk about music. Even still, I may play a record for him and sometimes he's like, "Turn that thing off." So you have to learn how to balance the relationship. It can be great, but it can be rough.
B&N.com: Ernie, as a guitarist who were your musical influences?
Ernie Isley: As a musician, I was influenced by my brothers. They hired one guitar player who they worked with for two years and bought him his first Stratocaster. His name was Jimi Hendrix. He was in the band between, like, 1963 and 1965. Then the Monterey Pop festival was, like, a year and a half after he left, and he went on to make a noise for himself in the world. I also have a great appreciation for guitarists such as Wes Montgomery and Curtis Mayfield. But most of the time, I try to listen to music as a whole, which is the way my brothers listen to music. And that explains why we can do a song that sounds like "It's Your Thing," with trumpets and saxophones and then do a song like "That Lady," without trumpets and sax. If you are into trying to find your own voice that means you can't sound like Carlos Santana. That's a hard thing for a musician to find his or her own identity.
B&N.com: Ernie's piercing guitar has become the signature sound of the Isley Brothers.
Ronald Isley: I know people who would never have been interested in guitar until they saw us perform songs like "Summer Breeze" and "Voyage to Atlantis." These folks weren't into Hendrix -- he was gone before they had the chance to see him perform. So seeing Ernie play was the first time a lot of the members of our audience were exposed to guitar solos. That's nice when you can help bring your audience along.
August 14, 2001
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